Erica “The ultimate expression of law is not order — it’s prison… The law and everything that interlocks with it was constructed for poor desperate people.” –George Jackson
Peace Africans! My name is Erica and I’m an editor at hood communist and I want to welcome you to hood communist radio!
State oppression breeds many versions of political activism, but prison activism continues to be a unique form of resistance. In George Jackson’s case, a liberation movement emerged from a space of captivity.
The legacy of George Jackson is felt through the continued resistance of prisoners today who, like Jackson, see the prison as not only an extension but an expression of a revolutionary underground ready to be organized.
Jackson’s legacy inspired the Attica prison rebellion. It is felt in the rebellious spirit of politicized prisoners, in the clarity of political prisoners, in each prison strike, and most certainly in Black August.
In this episode, Mack sits down with revolutionary organizer Kalonji Jama Changa to get the real deal on Black August —- a commemorative month rooted in and beyond the legacy of a dragon.
And with that said, let’s jump right in..
Kalonji My name is Kalonji Jama Changa. I am the founder and national chief coordinator of the FTP movement. I’m also part of a larger umbrella organization that we started a few years ago called the Siafu Movement. The Siafu Movement is an organization comprised of a number of other different organizations, including the African Martial Arts Institute, Free Them All Academy, Community Movement Builders, Siafu Youth Corps, National Coalition to Combat Police Terrorism, Urban Survival Preparedness Institute, Mammas Army, and I know I’m forgetting someone and somebody, but yeah, it’s a collective, you know. So I’m one of the founding members of the Siafu Movement as well, and author of a book called How to Be How to Build a People’s Army. And I’m also a documentarian. We have a film coming out called Organizing is the New Cool.
Salifu Nice, thank you. What is Black August, Kalonji? Like, What is it? What is that?
Kalonji Word. So Black August itself, you know, it is a commemoration. A lot of people, a lot of times I hear people, talk about “Happy Black August”, and “Black August celebrations”, and “we are having a Black August pole dance contest.” And, you know, Black August concert. I mean, you know, car wash, all that shit. I live in Atlanta, so anything can happen, you know what I mean? So you see all kinds of bullshit, but what the facts are. Black August is about the liberation of all political prisoners. One of the things that folks talk about political prisoners and, you know, most of the time you get a definition like political prisoners, someone who was targeted or imprisoned because of their political actions, affiliations or beliefs. But not often do folks talk about the fact that, you know, that some people are politicized inside of the prisons. You understand what I’m saying? And while in prison, they take up and maintain political struggle. You know what I mean? Oftentimes, you know, it’s a question of guilt or innocence. But with us as freedom fighters, it’s not a question of guilt or innocence. It’s a question of you resisting oppression. Either you on the right side of history or you’re not. Either you, when you say you were revolutionary, like Malcolm said, “revolution is bloody”. It’s not, you know, it’s not a Facebook tweet. Excuse me, a Twitter tweet. It’s not a Facebook post. It’s not just, you know, me hopping on hood communist, talking my shit. It’s like, how do we live our lives day to day and how do we work towards the liberation of our people who are here and are people who are who have yet to come.
Black August started within the thirty– at that time, the thirty three prison camps in the state of California. You know what I mean? They were brothers and sisters who were being tortured, abused and just all out forgotten. There were a number of different events in cases that led up to the Black August commemoration. Black August commemoration started forty-two years ago in 1979 outside the walls of San Quentin. Now, most folks, when they hear about Black, you talk about George and Jonathan Jackson, and that’s kind of the extent of the deal, you know. But it actually started on a timeline in 1970 with the assassination of 21-year-old WL Nolan, 23-year-old Alvin Juggs Miller and 21-year- old Cleveland Edwards. They were all shot in Soledad prison yard by a correctional officer, by the name of Opie G Miller. They had an altercation with Aryan Nation out there and …
Salifu …the Aryan Nation being like this group of white prisoners.
Kalonji Absolutely. So, you know, Aryan Nation is, you know, rampant within the prison system. They don’t matter where you are. You can be in the” Blackest prison”, you going to find that particular— some type of Aryan gang. So they got into it on the yard. They was whopping the Aryan Nation cats ass and the prison guard fired on his brothers and left them on the yard to bleed out. So they got everybody else off the yard and folks are trying to go back out there and they were firing on them. They was threatening to shoot them if they go outside during this rec time and try to aid their brother. So, you know, these brothers were murdered on the yard. Four days later, there was a prison guard that was beaten and thrown off the tier. And George Jackson, Fleeta Drumgoole, and John Clutchette who were later known as Soledad brothers were accused and charged for that retaliation. OK, so shortly after those murders and the arrest of the Soledad Brothers, George Jackson released his first book, which was called Soledad Brother: The Prison Letters of George Jackson. And of course, his second book, Blood in My Eye, was completed, you know, days before his assassination. So George was quickly thrust into the international spotlight and he later became the field marshal of the Black Panther Party. You know, I mean, Huey P Newton drafted him and, you know, became the field marshal. Now, what a lot of folks don’t know, W.L. Nolan and George Jackson allegedly founded the Black Guerrilla Family and the Black Guerilla Family, was actually a political organization before, as the state does, you know, tainted it and tried to criminalize it more or less, you know. So that’s how he had a very strong relationship. Nolan, although they were around the same age, was like a mentor to George.
On August 7th, 1970. George’s brother, Jonathan, who George inspired, George taught revolutionary tactics and teaching and so on and so forth, you know, he was sick and tired. As Fannie Lou Hamer, was so “sick and tired of being sick and tired.” And he decided to roll up on the Marin County Courthouse in California. And he was armed with several weapons, including an M1 carbine, and he was demanding the release of the Solidarity Brothers. So when he got there, Jonathan passed out tools to James McClain, who was on trial at the time itself for stabbing a prison guard. And he passed weapons on to William Christmas and Ruchell Magee. Ruchell Magee right now is a political prisoner who’s been— who is currently the longest held Black political prisoner in the United States. He’s been locked up for 58 years. In fact, he was just denied parole about a week and a half ago and he got another three. But moving along from that. So Jonathan walks us inside this courthouse, announces to the court officer. He says, “OK, gentlemen, we’ll be taking over from here.” They took hostage Judge Harold Haley, Deputy D.A. Gary Thomas, and a juror by the name of Maria Graham as they were traveling out. They got all these folks in the van. And as he was traveling out, there was an order given to not fire on the van. And allegedly, according to the state, the police didn’t get the memo from the other pigs and they opened fire on the van as they tried to escape. In the aftermath the judge, Jonathan, James McClain, and William Christmas were all murdered. OK, so that was the events of August 7th. And many people know that it was also this case that led to a manhunt on Angela Davis because they allege that she actually supplied Jonathan with the firearms or whatever. Of course, folks know that a lot of folks don’t know that Angela was inspired by George Jackson and many would say that she was in love with George Jackson and this revolutionary. So George introduced her and his 17 year old brother, Jonathan. And, you know, they became close as well. And of course, you know, the rest is history on that.
So, yeah, so a year from there, almost a year to date, a year and I believe like a year and two weeks, George, was 29 at the time, was assassinated by San Quentin guards after they claimed he smuggled a pistol under an Afro wig after visiting his lawyer. Now these motherfuckers, they go to extreme lengths. I’m saying even if he had— and everybody knows he had an afro— but imagine if he didn’t have an afro, but he was able to put on an Afro wig and put a pistol in in the visitor room that he allegedly got from his attorney. Now, he got to walk back through after getting checked and all that shit and be on a balancing act.
Salifu …[laughing] because there’s a pistol in his wig
Kalonji right, a pistol in his wig, you know, so they assassinated him because of the fact that George, again, at that time was recognized as an international figure. He was taking it a step further than Malcolm. And it’s no disrespect to Malcolm. But what I mean is he was still in prison. And like Mumia, he was writing books. He was talking revolution. He was inspiring brothers and sisters on the street and inside of the prison system, behind the walls, you know what I mean? He was the focal motor. He was the dragon, you know what I mean? So, you know, he taught himself a bastardized style of martial arts and he ended up teaching and training his comrades who were behind the wall. So he was a true freedom fighter and a true organizer. He didn’t just walk around saying, “yo, I’m George Jackson, fuck with me.” You know, I’m saying he had no no Facebook pages and none of that. He was a living example. He was— exemplified what would a revolutionary would look like behind the walls here in North America, you know what I mean?So shit went up, you know, across the country.
August 1st, 1978, Khatari Gaulden, who was the predecessor, shall we say, of George Jackson, one of his students. He actually was injured on a football field in San Quentin and refused medical treatment. Khatari was, we say he was assassinated as well because it was due to the medical neglect and the mistreatment. They denied him, denied him his treatment. So it ultimately led to his demise. One year later, brothers and sisters stood outside of the San Quentin prison and commemorated the first Black August in 1979. I want to point out real quick, too, that one of the things I learned from the OG’s was that during— many folks talk about the whole 60s era and you hear certain names or whatever because of the fact that these are the folks who were in the limelight for lack of better words. But simultaneously, there was a serious prison movement going on behind the walls as well. So while brothers and sisters were organizing on the streets, there was a serious organization moving across the country. So, so much so that when Huey or Bobby or Angela, whoever would end up being captured, they will be brothers and sisters that knew what time the prison bus would get there with them on it and it rolled up on them and let them know, listen, I’m such a surge, these hoop, and we are security. You understand…
Salifu …like what you’re saying is like when Angela Davis or Huey Newton or somebody would be arrested when they arrive at jail, there would be somebody behind bars that’s like, “I got you.”
Kalonji There’s an organized security system, just like you talk about the Black Panther Party or SNCCk or whoever else. There were different formations that were ready for them to arrive because we got to keep in mind that even with you all being younger than me, you know, I’m saying you’re going to inquire, excuse me, you’re going to encounter haters. You’re going to encounter folks that that want to see that they knock Huey out or they want to want to say that they did this to George or whoever the case is. But they had security there to make sure that they were good so that, A) they pigs couldn’t assassinate him or couldn’t be a state sponsored assassination because of the fact that, you know, without a doubt, there’s always a Judas in the mix, in the midst. So, you know, these folks who were getting those trinkets and everything they had to know, like, look, “if you move on this brother right here, you won’t be alive to to spend those 30 pieces of silver or to eat those cookies from the mess hall or whatever”, you know what I mean? So, yes, there was an organized front inside the camps, behind the walls that are not often talked about.
Salifu You have such a sort of like—– this information is history is like it’s like in your head, like it’s almost like you could, you know, you could wake you up in the middle of the night and you could like you could spit this history back like it’s nothing. How did you come to a place where you really started to understand all of this and almost made it so, like almost made it personal to know and understand? Like, why is this also important for you to know?
Kalonji I feel that I’ve been blessed to sit at the feet of “OGs” Original Gorillas on all sides of the continent, excuse me, on all sides of the globe. And I want to be able to teach my comrades and my children. I have grandchildren, you know what I’m saying? I want to be able to make sure they are getting proper history. When I’m around these OGs, I take so much in. And the sad thing about it is I almost wish that I could just share all of this shit with the world because of the fact that a lot of these folks are looked at is legendary. I’ve been blessed to know intimately and personal. You know what I mean? So a lot of times I have to sit and listen to some folks that don’t know jack shit about what they talking about, telling other folks about some shit that they regurgitating from somebody else that dont know what they talking about told them. You know? So I take it seriously. And I just feel like, you know, I represent, by default, my ancestors, my OGs and political prisoners who, for whatever reason, won’t be able to reach the Hood Communist audience. One of the main things about Black August is writing and supporting our political prisoners, you know what I mean? So definitely make sure that you all reach out to political prisoners.
I want to point out because I said the Black August was not a celebration, it is a commemoration, I want to point out that we fast during the month of Black August, right? So you fast from sunup to sundown. But we have what’s called Flea Days and the Flea Days are days that you fast for 24 hours. The Flea Days are the days that brothers were assassinated. So the Flea Days are August 1st in which we commemorate Khatari Gaulden , August 7th, which is the assassination of Jonathan Jackson, August 13th, which is which commemorates W.L Nolan,. Alvin Juggs Miller and Cleveland Edwards. Now I want to point out the 13th they were actually murdered in in January, but we commemorate their assassinations as part of Black August as well. And finally, August 21st, we commemorate the assassination of George Jackson, George Lester Jackson. And I’m pointing this out because of the fact that I’m sure that you and many others that are listening, you’ve ran across different things about Black all and you say, OK, Boom Garvey’s birthday and this is going on and that and all of that, you know, that’s that’s beautiful. You know what I’m saying? That those things, you know, we could commemorate brothers and sisters during the month of August, but the reality is the original concept for this comes out of this. Now, people can extend it and do what they will, but please, by all means, keep the political prisoners at the forefront.
Salifu Got it. So you brought up those— and thank you for that, because I want to ask you sort of a follow up question going back to that. So you laid out all those dates just now where during the month of August, you fast for 24 hours. What I was hoping you could do real quick —
Kalonji … the Flea days. Just for correction, right. The other days you fast from Sun-up to sundown.
Salifu So, yeah, you mentioned the Flea Days just now. What I wanted to ask you is could you just tell us— OK, so right now is what, July 28? July 27? 29th. OK. Yeah. July 29th. So in a few days August is about to start. So could you just run us through sort of— the month of August is about to start. How does Kalonji recognize Black August?
Kalonji It’s time for me to get the exercise routine, getting that up to par, getting the fight game on point. You know what I mean? Its discipline, you know? All the things you use slacking on during the year, straighten those up, you know what I mean? Renewed mindset. Like how folks do with a New Year’s resolution, but actually living it. Like we mentioned, fasting, exercising, refraining from negative situations. Now, being that we are at war, you know, certain disciplines are going to be, you know, more challenging than others. Right. You know what I mean? So, you know, and writing political prisoners, doing things in support of political prisoners, holding political education classes, you know what I’m saying? Because this is necessary for us to spread the gospel, so to speak, of Black August resistance and keeping in mind that it is absolutely about resistance. We say Black August, the response should be Black August resistance. You know what I mean? Because it’s a reminder, because when you talk about resistance, that’s not a party. So when we talk about the divide between celebrating and commemorating Black August– A celebration is usually a sign of victory. The celebration is a party, you know, you’re out there, you dance and so on and so forth, and, you know, you having a good time to loosen it up, so on and so forth. Our brothers and sisters are still behind the war, languishing, right? There are folks who lost their lives. It is a bad era for many folks because of the fact that we recognize that we are still at war. So you’re not there’s no parties in war, you know what I’m saying? That’s what the state does. They confuse us into thinking that it’s time for us like, you know, “nah we need time to fight. Let’s go to the club.” You know? I’m saying so that’s why we commemorate instead of celebrate. Aside from that, one of the things that they point out was that every year over 300 inmates inside of the California prison system are put inside of the hole they put in solitary confinement because of the fact that they are caught with Black August literature. When you commemorate Black August, they consider it inside of the California prisons as gang activity. You understand what Im saying? So I wouldn’t feel right celebrating while my brothers and sisters are in a hole being attacked and demoralized, etc., you know what I mean? So that’s why we say it’s not a celebration its a commemoration. It’s not fun times. You know, I mean, we may do some things that, you know, because of the fact that even as warriors, as fighters, you know, we need downtime. We not just walking around with red, Black and green draws on all the time mad. “Errr I hate evertyhing”, you know what I’m saying? But, you know, there’s times that we celebrate with our comrades, but that’s just not a is not a celebratory thing. Once we are victorious and imperialism and capitalism is crushed then we can celebrate every day a week. I’m trying to get it all before August 1st tho.
Salifu Man, I was just thinking about that. I just hit up Erica. I was like, man, we got —-
Kalonji this nigga talking about not drinking or smoking? You bugging! No debauchery?
Salifu Yeah. Wow. That first two weeks gonna killed.
Kalonji Yeah, man. But it’s a beautiful thing because of the fact that again, it’s difficult but like Chairman Fred said, “it’s terrible, but it’s fine.” You know what I mean? It’s like if we got to go to war, you’re going to be smoking no blunt in the foxhole, you know. Not with me, motherfucker. “Them niggas over there I smell weed,” you know? “There go the chicken. I smell it.”
Salifu Right. Right
Kalonji So, you know, it’s discipline. It’s going to be difficult for us all, especially with, you know, with the summertime sun, you know what I’m saying? But the beautiful thing, the difference between that and Ramadan is you can at least drink some water and shit during the day. So.
Salifu Right. For people who have never commemorated Black August before, it’s the first time even hearing about it but they feeling inspired or motivated to honor it or commemorate it this year. Where do you recommend they start and what are the things that you think are, you know, “hit these things and start here” ?
Kalonji Cool. I would say the first thing is definitely, you know, let’s be open for study. So I would say, I mentioned George Jackson. George has a couple of books out. Excuse me, Soledad Brothers and Blood In My Eye. I think I would definitely recommend those books because of the fact that it’d be good for you to get into the mindset of a George Jackson saying he’s the center. I would say he was the focal point. He was the center of Black August. He’s the most recognized when you talk about Black August. I would say definitely, you know, get those books, first and foremost. I know that BPM Black Power Media, we have a full month of activities that we’re looking to present, you know, on a regular so that we can encourage folks to help them along more or less, for lack of better words. Write a political prisoner, get a political prisoner list. One that’s consistent, but it’s not the only one, would be maybe the Jericho movement. They have a number of political prisoners that you could start off writing. We’re going to offer more of that because they have tons of political prisoners that you can check out. Work on. like I said, get an exercise routine. You don’t have to be Bruce Leroy. But, you know, if you can only do five push ups, you know, work on those six, you know what I mean? You might not be a runner for whatever reason. Whatever. Walk around the block, jog, do something. You know what I mean? Work on bettering yourself, work on the fasting situation, because fasting, the discipline behind that is you actually controlling what’s going on, going on inside your body, you know, I mean, it’s harder sometimes—excuse me, It’s easier sometimes for you to push it out than to bring it in. It’s easy for you to use your mouth to talk shit than it is to actually discipline yourself and say, look, I’m not going to eat certain things. I know this is bad for me. I might not be a vegan. I might not be a vegetarian and all that type stuff, but let me at least cut out pork. Let me at least cut out red meat for the month. You know what I’m saying? Chicken. Wherever you are. You know what I mean? I don’t— we have, you know, growing up the whole veganism and vegetarianism was rare for a lot of folks in the “movement”. You know, I mean, nowadays, folks want to know, do you wear flip flops? Do you vegan lollipops? Is your water alkaline? You know what I’m saying? How many books you read? You know, all of that sounds good. Meet yourself where you are and work towards moving forward from there.
So in a nutshell, I would say work on bettering yourself to simplify it, work on being the best you that you can be and work on helping others. And I’m saying, so if you don’t know anything else, start with being a good person. Say, “you know what? I’m going I’m a changed my ways for this month. I’m going to strengthen myself because of the fact that I say I’m a part of a cadre or an organization so I want to make sure that I am not the weakest link. I want to make sure that I’m adding something other than gossip, back biting. I’m not looking for vengeance because of the fact that someone checked me or some shit that I should have been checked on.” You know, I mean? I’m going to work on my discipline, so that would be the first start. Discipline makes it easier.
Salifu I feel like some part of the goal that a lot of people have with Black August is to to get more people to recognize it as a way to bring more people in. Right. But how how do we not fuck this up? Like, how do we not have Black August out here, like Black History Month or a Juneteenth or some, you know, some holiday that’s been co-opted by capital?
Kalonji Well, we’re not going to fuck it up, you and I, because we know better. But the thing is, with our people, again, we’re up against the state. We’re up against propaganda machines and so on and so forth. So it’s inevitable that there’s going to be some bullshit that’s coming out. We have to challenge it, but not in an antagonistic way unless they’re being antagonistic. We have to, you know, the thing is, as teachers, we have to be skillful. You know what I mean? It’s just like if you have children you can’t just go— your child stepped in some shit, you not gonna break the child’s leg, like, “look, you can’t walk over there.” That’s not— you know, and you got to be delicate with how you moving because our people are pretty fucked up and you turn them against us. And they’re like, “look, man, I’m trying to celebrate this thing, man and here you go, you know what I’m saying? see, that’s why down with this shit.”
But you know, I would say encouraging organization and organizational discipline. Unfortunately, nowadays you have so many new organizations and old organizations that don’t have any politics, they lack politics. They move strictly off emotionalism and sensationalism. And that’s the easiest way to get your ass killed or locked the fuck up, you know what I mean? So I would say being examples, you know what I mean? Hopefully something that you come across or even something that we discuss today can be used, you know, as a tool to better what it is that we’re doing as a whole. And, you know, so I would say that. But, you know, it’s inevitable that that—- and not only that, our people mean well. So like with Juneteenth and all that shit, you had the “pandemic”, you had the uprisings with George Floyd and Rayshard Brooks and others and I think that many of our people have gotten into their Blackness over the years. Even with the we’ve lost that Black Panther, the movie and shit. You know what I’m saying? Wakanda. You know, it became cool to wear dashikis. I haven’t seen cats wear dashikis like that since the 80s, you know, I mean, early 80s and late 70s, something like that. But it became cool. You saw folks that, you know, that don’t know shit about Africa, but they felt good because of Wakanda. We could have said, all man, your dashiki fake, you got this shit from China, you know, saying you had it right, but you meet a motherfucker with it. When I first came to Atlanta, I cut my locs because of the fact that any and everybody had locs. You know what I mean? So I was so much against just how it looked, but then when I started growing it back, I realized that folks could tell the difference in why I was wearing it and why someone else was wearing it. So for all practical purposes, usually I say” my dreadlocks” and then you got people trying to correct me saying, “Don’t call them dreadlocks”
SalifuI hate that. I hate that Yeah, that was not called the dreadlocks.
Kalonji What’s that? About not calling them dreadlocks?
Salifu Yeah. I hate that shit
Kalonji Look dude, I want these motherfuckers to dread me. Thats Right. No Problem. You know what I’m saying? These are naps. I ain’t trying to be cute. I’m angry. Whatever the fuck you want to stereotype me, it’s all good. You know what I’m saying? I ain’t trying to be cute. “Who do your locs?” Nature. So, you know. But yeah. So, you know, we meet our people where we at, man and we—
Salifu …And so you’re saying “ don’t we don’t scare people away.” We feel like we see we’re at that first sign at that strip club. We’re not going out to annihilate them. The idea is to provide some education —
Kalonji Now I ain’t saying that. Now some some shit a motherfucker might gotta get their ass kicked. Ass whoopings are political education, as well. You know what I’m saying? You just got to politicize those who are around while you whooping their ass. I see you out there doing such and such. WHAM! You out here, you disrespecting women, you raping sisters. BAM! You’re doing this, you violating. you know what I’m saying? But you got to teach while you moving along. You just can’t just jump out and start beating a motherfucker’s ass and they don’t even know why you whooping themt. Like, “oh man. Like how dare you do a Black August strip club joint” but you have to educate them and so you might want to drop them an email, you know what I mean? But, you know, just rolling up on them, you know, that might not be advantageous because, you know, they already got the crowd right now. “I came to see the strip club joint. Here you go talking about a food program. Nigga, I already ate.” You know what I’m saying? So we got it. We just got to be savvy with our approach and, you know, and I think that we’ll win from there with you.
But you— you all. You know what I’m saying, It’s funny because of the fact that — and I was talking to another comrade earlier and one of the things I was talking about was that the beauty of life and revolution is if you’re lucky, you get to witness the same shit that you feeding your OGs and your elders, meaning the younger I was, the more fiery, the more I was on some “revolution right now! you motherfuckers aint doing nothing. You ain’t even do nothing.” That was the game. That was the shit you talking. Right? So you fight so hard to advance and to get to that point where you are “in charge”. And by the time you finally get close to that particular joint, there’s another generation coming up behind you talking the same shit that you just finished talking to these other OGs. So now they telling you what the fuck you aint did. Like, nigga I just got here you know? So that’s how that go, man.
So salute to you all, man. And like I said, if I have any advice is just, man, you know, like like Kwame Ture said, man, he said, you know, “they your people. be patient.” You know? I’m saying he said, they mess up, you know, give em a chance. They mess up again, give them a chance. They mess up a third time. You got to off ‘em. You know what I’m saying? But you don’t just— you can’t just cut a cat head off, and they don’t know because you might be winning them over to revolution. One of the beautiful things that I’ve learned as well as organizer is to be able to go up in different places and recruit brothers and sisters. Many of them who are in movement right now will tell you places we met that you wouldn’t even believe that they ever went to. You know what I mean? Because they were in full violation and now they’re hardcore in their shit. Sisters and brothers that you would never imagine came from where they came from because of the fact that now you see the after effect. Folks don’t know what it took to get Mack to where he is right now.. You didn’t just wake up like “Im mad motherfucker”. It was a process, trial and error.
Salifu Right. Right. Right. All right.
Kalonji No doubt. But, yea I appreciate y’all for inviting me on, man. And hopefully, you know the shit I was talking made some kind of sense.
Salifu It did! You clarified a lot of things for me and taught me a lot of things for the first time. So I really appreciate you coming.